Hebrew Voices #73 – The Yellow Deli Twelve Tribes Communists

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Nehemia: So, look. We’re in America, and a lot of Americans hear this and they say, “This is un-American,” that it sounds like communism.

Nehemiah: It’s true communism. It’s spiritual communist.

Nehemia: Shalom, this is Nehemia Gordon and welcome to Hebrew Voices. In this episode, the “Yellow Deli 12 Tribe Communists,” I met with some folks who have chosen to live a different lifestyle. They are part of a network of 65 communes in over half a dozen countries. In the words of one of the men I spoke to they are, “true communists.” In addition to being self-described communists, they’re also, as I see it, part of a much wider phenomenon of people turning to the Hebrew roots of their faith and implementing aspects of the Torah in their lives, albeit in a very different way than most people I’ve ever met.

Recently, the 12 Tribes Yellow Deli people have been the focus of some controversies. When I went to meet them two years ago, I was not interested in these controversies. I wanted to understand how these folks interpret the Bible and try to live by it. This was a Hebrew Voice that I may not agree with, but I thought was worth hearing and knowing about. I do wonder to what extent some of the controversy surrounding the group are a result of their communist lifestyle.

I recently heard an interview with the political commentator Jonah Goldberg, who made a profound statement about communism. He points out that every family unit is communist. A family pools its resources and doles out those resources, each according to his need. You don’t withhold food from your two-year-old son because he doesn’t have a job. If you think about it, the family unit is also a benevolent dictatorship with the parents functioning as the politburo. I think the problem with communism is when you scale up from the family to an entire country. Instead of the rules being set by a caring mother, citizens are suddenly subject to the dictates of an anonymous bureaucrat in a distant capital. Instead of a loving father disciplining a child, it is the cold rod of the state. The murder and starvation of 100 million people in the 20th century at the hands of communists proves that what works for families does not work for countries.

Communism on that scale inevitably leads to abuse and must be called evil. But what about relatively small groups of people, like the Israeli kibbutz, a village commune consisting of less than 1,000 people? The big difference between a kibbutz and North Korea is that every member has a vote and can leave the kibbutz whenever he or she wants. In fact, a member who leaves a kibbutz in Israel is given money based on the number of their years of service, in order to get them started with life on the outside world.

In contrast, North Korea, and the Soviet Union before it, they were prison states, enslaving millions of people who had no vote and were not allowed to leave. How this compares to the communes of the Yellow Deli 12 Tribes is a fascinating question but was not my focus of interest when I went to speak with them two years ago. I wanted to understand why a group of Christians would choose to join a commune and live by aspects of the Torah in the 21st century. Here is my discussion with the Yellow Deli 12 Tribes community of Pulaski, Tennessee.

Nehemia: This is Nehemia Gordon, and I’m here with Nehemiah.

Nehemiah: Greetings.

Nehemia: Shalom. It’s great to be here, Shalom. Tell the audience, where are we? What is this place?

Nehemiah: Currently, we’re in Pulaski, Tennessee, which is in the southern part of Tennessee, just north of the Alabama border in a place called the Yellow Deli. And the Yellow Deli is a building that we configured on the interior, made of barn wood and all kinds of old relics that were normally abandoned in fields. And we filled our whole deli inside with beautiful barn wood.

Nehemia: But what’s special about this place isn’t the barn wood. What I think is special about this place is the type of food it serves and who it’s run by. And I was told, by these people, there is this deli which serves biblically clean food. They didn’t use the word “kosher,” which is a word I might use, but they said it’s biblically clean food and it’s run by these people who are called the “12 tribes.” Who are you guys? And tell us what this is about.

Nehemiah: Well, we’re part of a network of communities, and we believe in the reestablishment of a spiritual 12 tribe nation in the four corners of the earth. So, we do that by entering into a covenant with our master, Yahshua, the Messiah. And by doing that we give up our possessions and we share all things in common in order to be that priesthood that he desired from the beginning.

Nehemia: Okay, and we’re going to get back to that, all things in common. That’s interesting. And I hope that we can actually open up… you’ve got a Bible here, and that you can read me some of the verses that inspire you to do that. Because that’s actually a really fascinating aspect of what you guys do, but let’s save that for a little bit later. Your name is Asuria. Your name is Nekhemiah, or Nehemiah. Are those the names that you were born with?

Nehemiah: No, we were given those names.

Nehemia: You were telling me before we started recording about the process by which you’re given that name. And you’d said something really interesting. You said that you were given that name Nehemia, how did you describe it? “In a time of great turmoil,” you said.

Nehemiah: Tumultuousness.

Nehemia: Tumultuousness, and I was thinking, I got my name in a time of great tumultuousness. I was eight days old, and this man came at me with a knife and circumcised me. And at that point I was given the name “Nehemia,” but you were given it a little bit later than eight days. Tell me that story.

Nehemiah: When I moved into the community, my family and friends thought it was an extreme radical step that I took to actually obey the teachings of Yahshua and did not require such a radical obedience.

Nehemia: You’ve got to explain that, because my audience has never heard of you guys, I’m assuming, because I’d never heard of you guys until recently. What does it mean that you are following obedience to Yahshua? And you call… can I say this, that you called Jesus “Yahshua?”

Nehemiah: Correct, yeah.

Nehemia: Would that be fair?

Nehemiah: Yeah, His biblical name that he was actually given at birth.

Nehemia: And I’ve seen, is this correct? That you spell it Yahshua, because a lot of Messianic people and Hebrews people will say “Yeshua.” And there are other forms of it, but you say Yahshua.

Nehemiah: Yahshua, that’s right.

Nehemia: Yahshua, okay. So, the obedience to Yahshua, your family was opposed to that. What was your family? What was their religious background?

Nehemiah: Oh, we were pretty much Sunday Christians.

Nehemia: Okay, Sunday Protestant Christians?

Nehemiah: That’s correct.

Nehemia: Okay, which denomination, if I may ask?

Nehemiah: Assemblies of God.

Nehemia: So, you came from Assemblies of God, and you joined the 12 tribes, and they say, this is too much obedience, too radical. And what was it that you were doing that was too radical?

Nehemiah: For me, I saw this as a normal response to following the Son of God, just as the first disciples followed him. They left their jobs, occupations, and followed him wherever he went.

Nehemia: Oh, so that’s what you mean by “follow.” That you had left… what did you leave?

Nehemiah: I had an autobody business and a construction business that I ran full-time.

Nehemia: So, you left that in order to join the 12 tribes?

Nehemiah: That’s correct.

Nehemia: Is that a requirement? That you leave whatever your job is…

Nehemiah: Well, we see that the first disciples, when Yahshua would communicate the worth in what he was doing and he was establishing a kingdom, he called people to leave what they were currently doing. And so, Peter, he was a fisherman, and he left his occupation and followed the master.

Nehemia: By the way, I don’t know if the audience can hear in the background, there are people talking. We’re actually here in the Yellow Deli. People are coming, I guess the people who work here, and they’re making coffee. And so, that’s just part of the background and the atmosphere. So, tell us, what does it mean that you joined the 12 tribes? What did that entail? How did you hear about the 12 tribes?

Nehemiah: My mother was friends with the 12 tribes communities, and she’s the one who introduced me that they kept the Sabbath. And she suggested that we go and have a Friday night meal at their Sabbath celebration. They keep the Sabbath on Saturday, Friday night.

Nehemia: Okay, so I’ve got to stop you here. I love putting people in boxes; it makes me feel much more comfortable with who I am when I put people in boxes. Can I put you guys in the box that you are… what would be the term you would use?

Nehemiah: We’re disciples.

Nehemia: Disciples of Yahshua. But I think all Christians would say they’re disciples of Jesus, I think. Would you say that you keep Torah? Because you keep Sabbath, Friday night and Saturday, right?

Nehemiah: Yes.

Nehemia: Okay, what are other things from the Torah, from the Five books of Moses, that you believe are still, I guess, incumbent upon you today? Or that you still live by. Or is it everything?

Nehemiah: One thing that especially we’re seeing is in Genesis 18:19, how Abraham was called to command his children after him and his household after him to do righteousness and justice. And we see that righteousness and justice is seeking the welfare of others. And so, he was basically, we say the father of our faith. He was called out of his current occupation in his life, and he was called to go to a place and become something greater than what he once was.

Nehemia: So, that ties into when you joined the group, then you had to give up your job. And what did you do then? Did you have a job at that point, within the community?

Nehemiah: Well, I had business and equipment that I brought into the community. And because everyone has surrendered all that they have and it’s become common property to us all, everyone had access to those things.

Nehemia: We’re going to have to go back to that. Look, I’m coming from a Jewish perspective, and most Christians I deal with have told me that the law was nailed to the cross, that all the commandments that were given in Exodus and Leviticus and Numbers and Deuteronomy have been done away with. But you guys are keeping Friday night and Saturday as the Sabbath. So, am I wrong in assuming that you believe those commandments weren’t done away with? Or were they?

Nehemiah: We believe that the love of Messiah will fulfil the law, and just like our master said, not one jot or tittle of the law will be done away with. So, you’re familiar with this and we see ourselves as really groping to understand, because we believe that the true heritage of the faith of Abraham is something that really needs to be brought forth. It’s not something that’s easily captured.

Nehemia: But for example, you don’t eat pork or snakes. Hey, you’re laughing. I lived in China, and they had snake at the marketplace.

Nehemiah: I lived in Brazil, and they eat many kinds of things.

Nehemia: Okay. My Chinese friends, when I lived over in China, there were some Christians, and they made the joke, they said, “We know that Adam and Eve weren’t Chinese, because if they had been Chinese, they would have eaten the snake in the garden. They wouldn’t have talked to it.” They were joking, but only a little bit.

So, you don’t eat snake. You don’t eat pork. Explain to me in your terms why you don’t eat pork. It sounds like you’re not comfortable with the phrase that you keep Torah, but I think we’re dealing with semantics. What would be the terminology that you would use to describe what you do and what you don’t do?

Nehemiah: Well, we see that he is bringing us back to an ancient foundation, the God who created us, the one we serve. That for Israel of old He had certain Levitical laws, that the food that was provided by Him, if eaten, they would live a long and healthy life. And He promised that they would live long in the land if they were obedient to His commands. And so, we adhere to those laws of what He provided for food.

And so, what He calls “food,” that’s what we call “food,” even though it’s permissible to eat many other things outside of Israel. We do not condemn people that eat those things. But we ourselves want to be obedient to what He commanded Israel to eat.

Asuria: And there’s one other aspect to that that we recognize is that Israel, as a 12-tribe nation, needed to be retrained when they came out of Egypt. Obviously, these ways of the law were in Abraham, and he was trained by Elohim. We come to understand, the laws are merely a reflection, because when you have a nation after 400 years, coming out of Egypt, all kinds of things were in them. They had to be retrained, everything from tattoos to prostitution. They had to be trained to do this and not do that, so they needed the law.

Nehemia: So, you’re saying that keeping the Torah, and you might not like the term “keeping the Torah,” but observing these commandments, or these laws… what you’re saying is they actually are an educational tool, in a sense, that take you out of that place from where you came from, in a sense.

Asuria: Well, the law kind of shines on how Avraham was, because obviously, when God gave the law to Moshe, it was for a good reason, because they needed it.

Nehemia: So, it serves a function.

Asuria: That He obviously wants the law written on man’s heart. I would see the law as handy and very essential, because just like how the children came out of Egypt, we too find ourselves in a wicked and perverse generation, and we need to be trained.

Nehemia: So, you’re coming out of a spiritual slavery in a spiritual Egypt?

Asuria: A spiritual Egypt, yeah.

Nehemia: And it’s interesting, we have a saying in Israel. Israel is a country now of seven million people of whom six million are Jews. And most of those Jews, 99 percent of them, they or their ancestors came to Israel since 1880. In 1880, there were something like maybe, I don’t know, several thousand Jews in Israel, but pretty much everybody else came after 1880. And so, they came from the exile, and we have the saying that it’s very easy to take the Jew out of the exile. What’s difficult is to take the exile out of the Jew. And we don’t use the word “diaspora” very specifically. Diaspora is a different word that means the “scattering.” It’s not just scattering, it’s exile. And taking that exilic mentality out of the Jew is a really big challenge. And what you’re saying is that the Jews, or the Israelites, coming out of Egypt, that the Torah fulfilled the function of taking the slavery out of them and making them free men, in a sense.

Nehemiah: It was like a tutor.

Nehemia: A tutor, okay. And Paul says that; I think it’s in Galatians. All right, very interesting. Now, when you call yourself the “12 tribes,” is there anything in that that you say, that we’re now the 12 tribes and the Jews aren’t from the 12 tribes? How do you view the Jews?

Nehemiah: Well, the Jews are a remnant.

Nehemia: Okay. Of…

Nehemiah: Of the ancient 12 tribe nation.

Nehemia: Okay, so do you see yourself today as Israel in like a literal sense? There’s a thing called “replacement theology.” Do you ascribe to that? Or…

Nehemiah: We sometimes talk of ourselves as servant Israel, that many promises were made to Israel that were not fulfilled in their day. And so, since God’s word does not go out and come back void, there’s things yet to be fulfilled, as like the year of jubilee where Israel would celebrate seven sabbatical years, and then fulfill that in the year of jubilee when all things would go back to their original owner.

Nehemia: So, do you guys observe that in some way? Do you live according to…

Nehemiah: There is a time coming soon when we will begin to celebrate those sabbatical years.

Nehemia: How will that be implemented in your community?

Nehemiah: Well, once that first year begins, there’ll be a countdown.

Nehemia: They can’t see us. Asuria is nodding his head, and I’m taking that to mean good question. Like it hasn’t been implemented yet, so you’re not necessarily sure. Is that fair to say?

Nehemiah: If you get really into things like that, obviously, there’s a great purpose that God has behind a nation entering into a sabbatical year where they do the things that are written in Leviticus. Man hasn’t been able to comprehend it, and actually do it, without just some sort of pseudo doing it, you know. Just out of some sort of making a religion out of it. But we see that it has to be done as a people. We see that, first, we need to become a unified people. And then, when we’re a united front as a people, having the same mind, then we can start to enter into these things, and we’ll be led. We see we need to be led. How the first sabbatical year is going to be, it’s really never been done.

Nehemia: So, you won’t know until you do it, in a sense. You’ll see how you’re affected.

Nehemiah: We see the pattern, and we understand the law. And through those things, like not eating pork, or resting on the Sabbath, we see that these things lead us. And then, as we practice it, we begin to learn what it really takes to do it.

Nehemia: Right. And there’s all kinds of details that you don’t even think about and don’t come up until you actually implement it. It’s interesting. I called up earlier the man who runs this deli, Ranan. And I wasn’t sure what time you closed, and he said, “We’re open 24/5,” which I thought was really interesting. You’re closed on Shabbat, and you open Sunday at noon, not for religious reasons, when you could, theoretically, open Saturday night. You observe the Shabbat, you want to observe the sabbatical years and the Jubilee years, and you’ll be led how to do that. And you need to be a unified nation. So, you see yourselves as servant Israel, in a prophetic sense. Meaning, that’s not just a casual term you’re throwing out. You see yourselves as a fulfillment of things in the Bible, that phrase “servant Israel” I guess, in Isaiah, for example. Israel, my servant.

Nehemiah: Isaiah 49:6.

Nehemia: So, you see yourselves as a fulfillment of that.

Nehemiah: Hopefully.

Nehemia: Hopefully. Okay, you’re aspiring to be, then.

Nehemiah: Why not?

Nehemia: Well, look, a lot of my listeners would say that the reason why not is because the Jews are that servant, Israel. But other listeners would disagree.

Nehemiah: They’re just missing a few tribes.

Nehemia: Okay. Well, that’s true. We are missing, presumably, 10 tribes. We definitely have a concept of the 10 lost tribes in Jewish culture.

Nehemiah: Okay, so this is Jeremiah 31:31, and it’s in reference to Luke 22:20. It says, “Behold, days are coming, declares the Most High, when I’ll make a new covenant with the House of Israel and with the House of Yehudah, not like the covenant which I made with their fathers in the day I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt. My covenant, which they broke, although I was a husband to them, declares the Most High, but this is the covenant which I’ll make with the house of Israel after those days, declares the Most High. When I will put my law within them, and on their heart I will write it. And I will be their God, and they will be My people, and they will no longer teach again, each man his neighbor and each brother, saying, ‘Know the sovereign,’ for they will all know Me, from the least of them to the greatest of them, declares the Sovereign, or the Most High.”

Asuria: “And I will forgive their iniquities and their sin I will remember no more.”

Nehemia: So, where it says there, “The house of Judah and the house of Israel,” do you understand the house of Judah and that verse to be your tribe that you have up in the northeast? Or is that the Jews, and Israel is…

Nehemiah: You could understand this in many ways. And we can understand it in many ways. I would personally see that the natural Jews and the natural seed, obviously, they have, just like anyone, we all have things that we need to come to grips with, sin in our lives, rebellion. And so, that has to be dealt with just like the seed of Israel, which has gone to who knows where. And He says, it’s a promise here in Jeremiah, we believe that it’s going to happen that He’s going to gather them from where He spread them. So, that’s why we send the peacemaker bus. That’s why we built a Yellow Deli, because we believe the lost children of Israel will be gathered, and that’s going to be the servant nation. And it’s going to be a servant nation to be used by the Most High to regather His people.

Nehemia: Okay, very interesting. You talked about being a unified nation. Well, you said before, you give up all your possessions and they belong to everybody. That comes from the Book of Acts, right? Or does it come from somewhere else?

Nehemiah: Luke 14:33.

Nehemia: Open up to Luke. Let’s read it.

Nehemiah: We see these are one of the things that the apostles spoke to the men of Israel, because there was a command to not let there be any poor among you. And you can see in the Jewish culture, or any culture, Christian culture, there is not true equality. And it cannot be forced or constituted or legislated. But it has to be something from the heart, that man would voluntarily share what he has to meet the need of another.

Nehemia: That’s interesting. There’s so much to unpack here and talk about. Read me what you got there, Asuria.

Asuria: What I’d like to start with is in Exodus 19.

Nehemia: He’s taking us to the Tanakh. I love it. Exodus 19 in the Torah. Read it to me.

Asuria: I’ll just read in verse five to try to make this short.

Nehemia: And what translation are you using there?

Asuria: This is just the New American Standard.

Nehemia: Now, is there a specific translation that everybody in the 12 tribes uses?

Asuria: We use them all.

Nehemia: Okay, wonderful.

Asuria: And we love the Hebrew.

Nehemia: Amen.

Asuria: We’d love to have you help us.

Nehemia: All right, so what have you got there?

Asuria: It says, “Now then, if you indeed obey My voice and keep My covenant, then you shall be My possession among all the peoples, for all the earth is mine. And you shall be to Me a kingdom of priests, a holy nation. And these are the words you shall speak to the sons of Israel.” If I’m correct, this is before Moshe had to draw the line and purify the sons of Levi. His heart was that the whole 12 tribe nation would be a nation of priests, not just Levi.

Nehemia: That’s not the Jewish interpretation of this…

Asuria: That may not be, but that’s…

Nehemia: But that’s your understanding, okay. Do you see yourselves as that nation of priests? In other words, the Jewish understanding is that this verse is true today, and the entire nation of Israel, the Jews and whoever else, are that nation of priests. But you have a different understanding of it.

Asuria: We don’t see there is an Israel.

Nehemia: You mean a literal Israel?

Asuria: There’s no Israel.

Nehemia: So, the Jews aren’t Israel?

Asuria: Well, the Jews are a remnant. The Jews were, actually, so that we could even have this.

Nehemia: He’s pointing to the Bible when he says “this.”

Asuria: Yeah, I mean, we wouldn’t even have this if it wasn’t for the remnant that was left.

Nehemiah: We’re indebted.

Asuria: We’re indebted. It’s for His name’s sake that He left the tribe of Yehuda intact, partially. So, now then I go to I Peter 2:9. This is where we come from. It says, “But you are a chosen race, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, of people for God’s own possession, that you might proclaim His excellencies of Him who has called you out of darkness and into His marvelous light, because once you were not a people.” This is speaking of the servant nation that Nehemiah was talking about.

Nehemia: He means the other Nehemiah, yeah. The one sitting next to him.

Asuria: For you were “once not a people,” because obviously, a large portion of us aren’t of the natural seed, as far as we know. “But now, you are the people of God. You had not received mercy, but now you’ve received mercy.” So then, because of that, we see why Kefa, Peter, we see why He called them to be a nation, that they could become a nation. That’s why they started. There would be no poor among them. That’s in the law that goes back. You know, we can continue on here for quite some time. We could go back to the law and see how there would never be any needy among the people of God.

Nehemia: Okay. I mean, in Deuteronomy there’s a verse that says there’ll never cease to be poor among you.

Asuria: That gives you an opportunity to make sure they’re taken care of.

Nehemia: The way that you implement that is, you give all your possessions over to the community.

Nehemiah: We have a common purse together, in which everyone’s needs are met.

Nehemia: And I read that you’re registered in the US as a 501(d). Basically, you have a common purse, is what that means, and that’s actually legal in US law. I didn’t know that.

Nehemiah: Yeah, it is. We pay taxes. Even though we don’t use the school system we still pay our property taxes, our income, all those things.

Nehemia: Can we look at the passage in Acts 2 and 4, which talks about how the early church actually did this? Which I find fascinating.

Nehemiah: Acts 2, it starts actually in verse 38, where Peter was addressing the many different Jews that came from all different places. And that’s why the apostles spoke in different languages, in different tongues, because there were Jews scattered in every place they came from.

Nehemia: So, you understand speaking of tongues as they were speaking actually human comprehensible languages?

Nehemiah: That is correct. That’s what we understand.

Nehemia: Yeah, okay. And by the way, there was a sign downstairs in the deli which says, “27 days left to Shavuot,” which I thought was so cool. I’m sure people walking off the street in Pulaski, Tennessee who are probably wondering, “What is Shavuot and why are we counting down to it?” I thought that was cool, because I do what we call the counting of the omer. We count every day to Shavuot.

Nehemiah: We recall the omer.

Nehemia: That’s so cool.

Nehemiah: Yeah. We just got finished with the days of unleavened bread, so we close up Deli for those seven days.

Nehemia: Oh, you do?

Nehemiah: We do, because we cannot produce leavened bread if we’re keeping the feast of unleavened bread.

Nehemia: Okay, that’s pretty cool. So, what, is there a sign that says, “Closed for unleavened bread?”

Nehemiah: Yes, we did make a sign. We warned people in a graceful way that we would be closed during that time.

Nehemia: That’s cool

Nehemiah: We take the leavened out of our house.

Nehemia: All right, what you got there? Verse 38.

Nehemiah: Peter said to them, “Repent, and each one of you be baptized in the name of Yahshua for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the holy spirit.”

Nehemia: I gotta stop you there. Do you guys do baptism?

Nehemiah: We do water baptism.

Nehemia: Of adults or children or both?

Nehemiah: Someone who is at the age of accountability, they’re ready to make a covenant, we would have a bar or a bat mitzvah celebration for them.

Nehemia: Oh, you do? Is that at 12 or 13, like Jews do?

Nehemiah: Depending on the age of accountability, or when they’re spiritually ready to make that covenant.

Nehemia: And that might be later than 12 or 13.

Nehemiah: It could be 14 or 15.

Nehemia: All right, I don’t know if we’re going to pick this up on the mic, but there’s a young man sitting here who’s listening to the interview. He is the son of the man who runs the Deli. What is your name?

Zion: Zion.

Nehemia: Your name is Zion, like the place of Zion. So, Zion, how old are you?

Zion: 17.

Nehemia: Did you do a bar mitzvah? Did you decide to enter… what is it? Enter into the covenant, is that the phrase you used?

Nehemiah: Be a son of the covenant.

Zion: I did have a bar mitzvah at 15.

Nehemia: Okay, and you actually had a choice?

Zion: I did.

Nehemia: Give it to me straight. Did you really have a choice?

Zion: I did have a choice.

Nehemia: And what did you choose?

Zion: I chose to be a part of what I saw here, what my parents were doing.

Nehemia: So, you became part of the covenant. At 15 he did that, that’s interesting. And so, he was baptized. And what else does he do when he comes into the covenant?

Nehemiah: He would come into the fellowship of the breaking of bread, in which we observe every Saturday night, which we see as the first day of the week. We would break bread together.

Nehemia: Is that parallel to what many Christians do, as like the Eucharist, the eating of the wafer?

Nehemiah: We actually have an unleavened loaf.

Nehemia: It is unleavened. Interesting.

Nehemiah: A large unleavened loaf.

Nehemia: And you do that every Saturday night?

Nehemiah: Every Saturday night when we break bread.

Nehemia: So, that’s parallel to what it says in the New Testament about the meeting on the first day of the week. Is that right?

Nehemiah: Just like Paul; he was in the upper room breaking bread.

Nehemia: That’s very interesting, because many Jews will do what we call a post-Shabbat, a motsa’ey Shabbat celebration. As Shabbat ends at sunset on Saturday night, they’ll then do, some people call it a “Melave Malka.” It’ll be a celebration on Saturday night. It’s very interesting.

Nehemiah: We actually have a resurrection celebration every Saturday night when we break bread.

Nehemia: That’s fascinating.

Nehemiah: It’s actually at the beginning of the first day.

Nehemia: So, until they enter into the bar mitzvah, become part of the covenant, they can’t eat of that, is what you’re saying?

Nehemiah: That is correct.

Nehemia: That’s interesting. Okay, so he comes into the covenant or the fellowship of eating the bread, which is the unleavened bread. He’s baptized, and is it full immersion?

Nehemiah: Full immersion.

Nehemia: Full immersion. Is that it? Or are there other things, as well?

Nehemiah: We have morning and evening gatherings every day, every morning and evening. All Israel would offer up a lamb every morning and evening for a sacrifice. In the new covenant, in the new and living way in Romans 12:1 and 2 it says, “Offer your bodies,” plural, “as a living and holy sacrifice.”

Nehemia: How do you do that? What do you do in the morning and the evening?

Nehemiah: That is a place where we come to hear our Creator speak to us through what we all bring to our gatherings. And so, just like He met with Moshe and Aharon in the tent of meeting, He said, “There I will meet with you and speak with you.” So, it’s like an appointed time for us every morning and evening.

Nehemia: Tell me what it looks like, because I’ve never been to one.

Nehemiah: Well, we would begin with song and…

Nehemiah: We actually greet one another first with, “Shalom.” A very social time right in the beginning where we hug one another, we embrace one another. We haven’t seen each other all day, so it’s a very social time where we could go around and greet one another.

Nehemia: The children don’t get to come to that until…

Nehemiah: Oh, they do. Everyone comes to that.

Nehemia: So, what happens when they enter the bar mitzvah age? What happens at that point? In other words, you’re saying that once you enter into the covenant, there are certain things like the baptism… and do you use the word “baptism?” Or do you use a different one?

Nehemiah: Yes.

Nehemiah: Or immersion.

Nehemia: So, baptism, immersion, Bar Mitzvah, eating of the bread.

Nehemiah: That would be the inauguration into the priesthood, where they have the ability to intercede for, not only themselves, but for others.

Nehemia: Okay, so is that part of what happens every morning and evening? Is there an intersession that’s going?

Nehemiah: Yeah, we have very, like I said, social interactions and then we begin singing songs that we’ve written and dances that go with those songs.

Nehemia: And you do that every day, twice a day.

Nehemiah: Every day, 6 in the morning and 6 in the evening, very early in the morning.

Nehemia: Now, this place, the Yellow Deli, is open 24/5. Who’s running the place during those times?

Nehemiah: We have set apart people that are on a schedule…

Nehemia: I’m a Jew. We have all these laws.

Nehemiah: …that are dedicated, that are on a schedule that we move different people through there, so other people can get to the gatherings.

Nehemia: Oh, they take turns.

Nehemiah: We take turns, that’s right.

Nehemia: I gotcha. All right, you were reading me Acts 2:38. Let’s go on to verse 39.

Nehemiah: “For the promises for you and your children and for all who are far off, as many as the Lord our God will call to Himself. And with many other words, he solemnly testified and kept on exhorting them saying, ‘Be saved from this perverse generation.’” And so, we see those many other words are all the commands that Yahshua told his disciples to keep.

Nehemia: We’ve got to back up there. Read that again. Now that we know what to pay attention to, read that again.

Nehemiah: Okay. This is Kefa speaking, Peter.

Nehemia: So, we’re now in Acts 2 verse 39. Is that right?

Nehemiah: He’s standing in Jerusalem, addressing the men of Jerusalem. He said, “With many other words, he solemnly testified and kept on exhorting them, saying, ‘Be saved from this perverse generation.’”

Nehemia: That was verse 40. Now verse 41.

Nehemiah: “So then, those who had received his word were baptized. And that day, there was added about 3,000 souls.”

Nehemia: Did I miss it, where you said that they have to be obedient? Did you say, to the things that Yahshua taught the people?

Nehemiah: Because right before he left to ascend into heaven, he says, “All authorities have been given to me. Go and make disciples of all nations.” And then he said, “Commanding them to teach them all the things that I’ve commanded you.” And so, they actually had something to pass on. And so, those are the many other words that he spoke.

Nehemia: So, what are the things that he commanded them? What do you understand that to be? Meaning everything he taught throughout his ministry, is that what it means?

Nehemiah: That’s correct. You know, about loving one another as I have loved you, surrendering all as you have done.

Nehemia: Okay. And that brings us to the next part here.

Nehemiah: That’s correct. So, the response, the loving response, just like a married man would share all that he has with his wife, a loving response to someone who just died for your sins, this is the reciprocative response.

Nehemia: I like that word, “reciprocative” response. That’s how you reciprocate, is basically it.

Nehemiah: That’s correct. “They were continually devoting themselves to the apostle’s teaching and to fellowship, and to the breaking of bread and to prayer.”

Nehemia: Okay, that was verse 42. Now verse 43.

Nehemiah: “Everyone kept feeling a sense of awe and many wonders and signs were taking place through the apostles. And all those who had believed were together, and had all things in common. And they began selling their property and possessions, and were sharing them with all, as anyone might have need. Day by day, continually, with one mind in the Temple and breaking bread from house to house, they were taking their meals together with gladness and sincerity of heart, praising God and having favor with all the people. And the Lord was adding to their number daily, those who were being saved.”

Nehemia: So, you implement this, if I understand correctly from what you said. The community that you’re part of shares all the property to where you came in with your tools from your auto business, and you shared that among everybody to use. Let’s say you have some expensive piece of equipment. How is it decided who gets to use that?

Nehemiah: I mean, the community moved into my house.

Nehemia: They moved into your house, like the actual house you owned?

Nehemiah: Yeah.

Nehemia: Are they still in that house?

Nehemiah: No, we sold it and bought a farm.

Nehemia: Oh, they sold it. Wow, okay. Look, we’re in America, and a lot of Americans hear this and they say, “This is un-American,” that it sounds like communism.

Nehemiah: It’s true communism.

Nehemia: Tell us about that.

Nehemiah: It’s spiritual communist.

Nehemia: But it’s also literal communism. In other words, it’s not communism on the scale of the Soviet Union…

Nehemiah: Which is legislated.

Nehemiah: Maybe what we could say is what our master said. “No one can be my disciple unless he gives up all his possessions.”

Asuria: Communism, I think that was before Karl Marx wrote his books.

Nehemia: Here’s a really interesting story that you may not know. Karl Marx wrote his book in 1848. In 1850 there was this uprising in China called the “Taiping Rebellion.” I learned about this because I lived in China for a year. And it was a man who believed he had a vision that he was the brother of Jesus Christ. That’s what he believed. And he looked in the Books of Acts, this passage, and he said, this would be the blueprint for his kingdom. And to this day, the government of China calls him a “proto-communist,” in that they shared all their property. Of course, they were eventually violently put down by the Western powers who saw this as a threat to the Qing dynasty of China, which they were able to kick around.

And you might say the guy was completely crazy. I think everyone would pretty much agree on that. But he looked at this passage, and this became an inspiration for what, later, people tried to do in communism, even though it was actually after Marx wrote his book. But then, communists looked at that and they said, “Hey, we can follow this pattern.” They weren’t thinking of Acts 2; they were thinking of the heavenly kingdom of the Taiping Rebellion.

But he in turn was looking at Acts 2. So, it’s interesting how things have come along and developed based on this passage, how influential this passage has been on things in the world. You know, that was a kingdom of tens of millions of people for 15 years and it tried to implement this. I don’t think it was very successful, but that’s a different story.

So, it’s interesting. It’s hard to read this passage and not think of communism. And communism was partially inspired by this passage. But you’re saying you are spiritual communism. And in Israel, we have something called the kibbutz. So basically, if I understand correctly, you guys are similar to a kibbutz, except with a spiritual dimension. Kibbutzim, most of them were atheists, Marxists. Some of them were religious, though. And what they would do is, they would share all their goods in common, but not their personal property. Do you guys do that with your personal property? In other words, that shirt that you’re wearing, does Asuria own that shirt? Or does the 12 tribes own that shirt? And those shoes you’re wearing down there, Nehemiah, are those your shoes? Or are those the 12 tribes’ shoes? I’m a Jew. I’ve got to figure out the legalities of how this all works, the technicalities.

Nehemiah: These were bought for me by the personal needs in my household, and they were given to me. So, I would say I steward these shoes, and own these shoes, and wear these shoes.

Nehemia: Okay, but if Asuria comes one day when you’re not around and puts your shoes on, is that a problem? I’m not trying to be funny, I’m serious.

Nehemiah: I personally would not have a problem with that.

Nehemia: You would not?

Asuria: I would, because they wouldn’t fit.

Nehemia: Right, but you get my point here? You’ve got a phone over there. Who owns that phone? Do you own that phone, or does that belong to the community and you steward that for the community?

Nehemiah: I think the point that you’re trying to get at is how we exercise authority. That’s how we see it. We see responsibility and authority, because our giving up everything goes exactly how messiah planned it. Because there has to be a nation that produces the fruit of the kingdom, and this kingdom of priests, this 12-tribe nation of priests discern what is clean and unclean.

So, a priest, as he discerns what’s clean and unclean, he understands that greed, selfishness, these things that work in the human heart, are the real problem. And so, yeah, you can be possessive of your shoes, but you might have four pairs of shoes. And if you don’t see the one with only one pair of worn-out shoes, how can the love of God be in you? And so, we see it as a spiritual challenge, to challenge our greed, to challenge our selfishness, because we know that God’s not selfish. We know that He loves all men, but we do believe in authority and responsibility. And so, I have things, but am I willing to use them to benefit the all? Or am I trying to accumulate things for myself?

Nehemia: Let me go back to the kibbutz movement. I love history, and even the history of modern Israel. I actually lived in a kibbutz for a year in 1990 to ‘91, as a volunteer. I wasn’t a member. They actually have a protracted membership process. Probably, it sounds more complex than your process. So basically, on the kibbutz, there were somewhere like around 300 kibbutzim when I was on the kibbutz in 1990. Today, there’s somewhere in the neighborhood of 30, I believe, and that’s because most of them went bankrupt.

And they had this problem, and maybe what they were missing was the spiritual dimension. But they had the problem that everybody, no matter how hard they worked, made the same amount of money. And there were people who had greater skills than others, and they said, “Wait a minute. I could move to the town next door and be a millionaire, because I have these amazing skills. Why would I want to be on this kibbutz and make the same running the factory as the guy who sweeps the floors?” And you ended up having this drain of skills out of the kibbutz. And you ended up, really, with the people in most kibbutzim who didn’t have skills and didn’t have motivation. They were the ones, by the third or fourth generation… I mean, when it started out, it was a survival necessity to have the kibbutz. They were surrounded by enemies, living in swamps and just trying to survive. And by the third or fourth generation, people said, “No, I could do really well in the free market. Why would I stay on this kibbutz?”

And you ended up having all the people with skills leaving, and the people who weren’t motivated. To the point, in Israeli culture, we have this phrase which is, “Life’s not a kibbutz.” Which is a song, “It’s cold outside. Life’s not a kibbutz.” If you’re in the kibbutz you’re protected and you’re sheltered. But you guys have something the kibbutzim lost. Meaning, the first generation, they were ideological. The second generation a little less, the third generation was just cynical. You have the spiritual dimension that presumably will perpetuate. I don’t know if it will; I guess you’ll see over time. Zion will let us know in 30 years from now. Does it perpetuate into the next generations, the way that a communist secular ideology, I don’t think, could? It would be very difficult for that. A spiritual ideology, that might work. That’s fascinating to me.

So, they say the destruction of the kibbutz movement was something called the “electric spoon.” The electric spoon was a little device you put in your cup of water, and it heated the water. And how did it destroy it? Because when the kibbutzim first started, everybody shared everything. Basically, all you had was the clothes on your back, and the shoes on your feet, and everything else was shared. And then, one day somebody came and said, “I want an electric spoon.” Wait a minute. If you want hot water, you come to the mess hall, the kheder okhel, and you get hot water with the rest of the community. The electric spoon is to make hot water in your house by yourself.

And they got the electric spoon. And that was in like late 1940’s, early 1950’s. They say from there on down, it was all downhill from there. Because people said, “Now, I don’t want just an electric spoon, I want an iPhone, and I want a car. I don’t want to share that with anybody. That’s my car.” It’s interesting. I just think it’s fascinating. It’ll be interesting to see in the generations to come how your movement deals with those issues. Maybe you can learn lessons from the kibbutz movement of what not to do.

Nehemiah: Well, you could even see that Yahshua, what he said in Luke 14:34 is that “No one could be My disciple unless he surrenders all his possessions, because possessions possess you.” And so, to voluntarily relinquish those possessions, to seek the welfare of others, goes right back to Genesis 18:19, “to do righteousness and justice,” which we see that as seeking the welfare of another. And so, that points to what it says in Matthew 24:14. It says, “This gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in the whole world, as a witness to all the nations, and then the end shall come.” And so, we see that common life lived out, where man is seeking the welfare of another who is not holding on to what sustains him, but giving out of what sustains him. Just like the poor widow gave those two copper mites. He said she gave more than all the people that put money into the treasury. She gave out of what sustains her.

Nehemia: So, do you understand the gospel of the kingdom as part of this common living?

Nehemiah: That’s correct. And that is to be a witness and light to the nations of a standard of love that God is raising in our midst, to live and love selflessly. And so, that’s what the world needs to see is not just another steeple, but people living out.

Nehemia: That’s a good motto, not a steeple, people.

Nehemiah: And that was the witness.

Nehemia: I’ve got to go back to the kibbutzim just for a minute, because a question came up for me that I want you guys to respond to. One of the reasons that the kibbutzim did work for nearly 100 years is that they were small communities. You never had, on a kibbutz, more than around 500, 600 people. And the very thing that made the kibbutzim work is the reason that institutions like the Soviet Union did not work. In the Soviet Union, you had millions of people. And so, you had an entire professional bureaucracy in Moscow deciding what they would make in a factory in the Ukraine. People weren’t controlling their own lives. They were basically the slaves of these bureaucrats, and it was doomed to failure. Whereas the kibbutz, everybody got together, and they would vote.

And yes, there was a drain of certain people who would leave the institution, but those who stayed, they said, “Look, this was the will of our community. We’re going to do this in this factory. We’re going to do this that way, because my neighbors made that decision with me, not some guy in a different city in a different place I never met.” So, how does your community deal with that? I understood you have these small communities. How do they interact with each other? Is there a central leadership which issues rulings to the people in Pulaski, Tennessee? Or do the people in Pulaski, Tennessee, do they decide what the policy… How does that work?

Nehemiah: Each community is self-governing. And so, we have a cohort of leaders in each community who govern and rule over that community and watch out for the welfare of the people that live there. And we have industries, like in Pulaski. We have a deli that supports our community financially.

Nehemia: A Yellow Deli.

Nehemiah: A Yellow Deli. Not just a deli.

Nehemia: And by the way, I’ve got to just interrupt you and say, this coffee you served me; can you tell us what this is? This might be the best coffee I’ve ever had outside of Israel. This is the house blend.

Nehemiah: That is a called a master blend, and that’s our own concoction that we’ve come up with that seems pleasing to many.

Nehemia: This is very pleasing. It’s a brew. It definitely leaves Starbucks in your dust. This is amazing coffee. It’s delicious. All right, so you have leaders who make the decisions for the community.

Nehemiah: In the local community, but we also work with other communities close by, like in a region together, and maybe we need people here or we might send people over there to other communities to help. But we also work tribally. A tribe would have other communities or land…

Nehemia: What is a tribe in your definition?

Nehemiah: A tribe is a geographical location. This southern area would be the tribe of Benjamin, or Binyamin. And we have seven communities.

Nehemia: Southern means the entire southern US?

Nehemiah: From the Mason Dixon line south…

Nehemia: Oh, the tribe of Binyamin, okay.

Nehemiah: …from the east coast to the Mississippi.

Nehemia: See, I’m a Jerusalemite, so I think of Benjaminites as Northerners, because I come from the border of Judah, it’s Jerusalem, although where I live in Judea. Okay, so this is the tribe of Benjamin. What are some of the other tribes?

Nehemiah: Well, let’s begin with Judah.

Nehemia: Where’s that?

Nehemiah: Judah would be the northeast kingdom.

Nehemia: Like, Vermont; is that part of Judah?

Nehemiah: Yeah, New York, Connecticut, Massachusetts.

Nehemia: Wow, you’ve got a lot of communities all over the place, it sounds like.

Nehemiah: Yes, about 65 communities worldwide.

Nehemia: You have 65 communities worldwide? I had no idea. Because you were 12 tribes, I kind of assumed there were 12 little communities. Give me an example of an interaction that took place recently between all 65 communities.

Nehemiah: We have Inter-tribal meeting. Inter-tribal leaders from all the tribes, two to four people from each tribe would come and converge on one of our communities. We have a conference center in North Carolina.

Nehemia: How many people are in the 12 tribes?

Nehemiah: Thousands. We don’t take census.

Nehemia: Thousands, okay. So, they come together…

Nehemiah: We decide on the smallest of things about our life, of the things that we eat, how we should dress, how we should carry ourselves, how we should have our industries, the training of our children, the running of our delis. Many, many factors are considered and talked about and are decided.

Nehemia: Can you just give us one example of a decision that was made recently of a small thing? What’s a small thing that was decided recently? Or maybe not recently, but that was decided inter-tribally.

Asuria: In preparation for the 50-year countdown, some of us went to what we call an “inter-tribal agricultural meeting,” where those of us involved in agriculture had a conference and talked to each other about what it’s going to take to possibly, in a short amount of time, when we start to do the sabbatical years, what that means to provide food for our people.

So, we have to start aiming at certain parameters in certain directions about how to store food, because we believe that the produce of the sixth year is going to be enough to carry us through to the eighth year. And this is a mystery in one way, but in another way, we have to make practical decisions about heading in a direction. But also, we have to be led. So, we came up with a few decisions about how to begin.

So, what we really want to do in our agriculture is we want to make sure, to start with, that we produce the grain and distribute the grain that the communities need in a local region, a tribal region, and an inter-tribal region, start with how that particular need would be met. And so, by doing that, we’ll learn how to store, how to distribute, and how to provide for that foundational need just in agriculture.

Now, many times when we come together in councils, we talk about the spiritual condition. Because we know that there’s one fundamental thing in all this, that maybe the kibbutzim didn’t understand, and communism didn’t understand. You cannot legislate love. Love comes out of a human being towards another. All you can do is find out where you don’t love, and desire to change. And so, then that’s what we hope is going to build the nation of Jeremiah 32, that we’re the re-gathering of the 12 tribes from where they were dispersed. We believe in the last days that kingdom is going to be re-gathered as a spiritual servant nation to do what physical Israel couldn’t do.

Nehemia: And when you say “re-gathered,” you mean re-gathered to Israel? Or where do you mean?

Asuria: Well, all that we know is in Jeremiah… and we see that it’s not going to be once again written on tablets of stone, but this time it’s going to be written on the heart. The law of God would be on the heart, that human beings would actually be gentle. They’d care for one another. They would understand their own weaknesses so that they would be patient with others’ weaknesses. And actually, we would live as messiah lived. Now, we would be united in the likeness of his death. He gave up everything to be able to make it so that we could live like he did, love the way he did. He laid down his life for us, so we lay down our lives for one another. And when we don’t, we allow that to be exposed.

Nehemia: All right, I want to do a quick lightning round of questions before we wrap it up. Before, you mentioned the name Yahweh. Is that a name that you use all the time? Is that important?

Nehemiah: We see Yahweh as our Creator, initiator and Father of all life, and we normally address Him as our Father. In our gatherings, our prayers, we do sing songs with that name in it. It is used, but not a very common use. You know, we want to have reverence for Him.

Nehemia: And Yahshua, that name. Talk to me about that.

Nehemiah: We acknowledge that was his given name at birth, that the angel Gabriel spoke to Miriam and her father that he was to be named “Yahshua,” who will save his people from their sins. And so, we’ve gone back to just the original name…

Nehemia: So, if someone comes into your community and they just can’t get that word “Jesus” out of their vocabulary, is that an issue for you?

Nehemiah: It’s something that, especially for guests that come, I would not just automatically say Yahshua, I would use the word Jesus.

Nehemia: Oh, you would? You’re comfortable with that.

Nehemiah: Just out of respect for them. Some people do know about Yahshua…

Nehemia: Okay, so you’re not what will be called the “sacred name group.” I call those people the word police.

Nehemiah: Yeah, we don’t want to police people.

Nehemia: They’ll say, “You can’t say Monday, because that was worshipping the moon.” But that’s how you say it in the English language. You know, they say, “We can’t say God. You have to say Elohim.” Sacred namers will tell you that. And I say, “Look, I could talk to you in Hebrew our entire conversation. Ata lo tohav et ze im ani e’eseh et ze. You won’t like it if I do it, unless you understand Hebrew.” But okay. So, you guys aren’t like that at all.

Nehemiah: We want to be like Paul, who was all things to all men. And so, we want to talk to people on a level that they can understand and comprehend, and we want to make friends there.

Nehemia: All right, so what happens when you die, in 60 seconds or less? Heaven, or hell? What do you guys believe about that?

Nehemiah: We believe in three eternal destinies of men. Most common Christian doctrines are heaven and hell. But we see that millions of people have lived and died and have lived according to their conscience since the creation of man, who did not know the Yahshua of the Scriptures. And so, we believe that those men who lived righteously, even though they sinned, because we’re born of sin nature as Adam did, but those men… there’s a reward for those who do righteous deeds that they know in their conscience they should do.

And so, we believe there’s actually a reward after they’re resurrected and have given account for their deeds while they were on the earth. In Revelation 22:11 it speaks about three categories of man. One is the filthy and the unjust, which a filthy person would be those who would give themselves to very unclean practices, take advantage of others. And the unjust would be those who prey upon others for their own financial gain. It could be a trash man charging too much for the trash. It could be an unjust lawyer. And then it talks about the righteous or the just, that they will be righteous or just still. And we believe that’s a man who abides by his conscience, who listens and adheres to the dictates of their conscience.

All know to not steal, murder, to lie. That’s indelibly marked in man’s conscience. And then, it speaks about, “And let those who are holy be holy still.” We see that those are like Abraham, who was called to be holy. No halo: holy means set apart. And so, many people down through the ages were righteous men who did righteous deeds…

Nehemia: But were not “holy.”

Nehemiah: …but they were not holy. That’s Abraham, we’re told.

Nehemia: That’s very interesting teaching. Any other last things you want to share with the audience?

Nehemiah: We have these buses called the “Peacemaker Bus.” And if you’d like to look at them, they’re on YouTube. If you look up Peacemaker Bus, you’ll see hundreds of pictures of the buses.

Nehemia: And what do they do?

Nehemiah: We use these buses mainly for evangelistic purposes, to go out and make friends, let people know who we are. Many people have come home with us on the bus to visit our communities and now are part of our 12 tribes communities. And we’ve taken them out doing free medical care for people in concert scenes. And we’ve gotten to thousands of cities in the US and abroad with our different buses. It’s a wonderful way for us to meet people and to let people know what we’re about. It’s a big maroon and green bus.

Nehemia: So, if you see a big maroon and green bus, that’s you guys.

Nehemiah: It’s called the “Peacemaker Bus.”

Nehemia: So, you build these buses?

Nehemiah: We do.

Nehemia: That’s pretty cool. How do you build a bus?

Nehemiah: We use old buses, and we restore them, like the Deli.

Nehemia: Oh, wow, so you don’t build them from scratch.

Nehemiah: No, that’s an Arrow Coach.

Nehemia: An Arrow Coach. That must have been a sleeper bus.

Nehemiah: And that’s another bus put together.

Nehemia: Oh, it’s actually two buses combined. Oh wow, this is a big bus. How many people live in this bus?

Nehemiah: It can sleep 17 people.

Nehemia: 17 people. Is there a restroom for 17 people?

Nehemiah: There is a restroom, and all these couches, they have hinges. So, this flips up into bunks in just a few moments. And then we have a real loft, so you can sleep a couple up here. We have a front loft which can sleep two couples up there. And then these rear boosts break down into… Go ahead, back there in the kitchen.

Nehemia: Wow, so you guys travel in this bus?

Nehemiah: We do. We’ve done hundreds of thousands of miles.

Nehemia: Hundreds of thousands! Not in one trip…

Nehemiah: No. We’ve gone sometimes 10,000 miles in one trip.

Nehemia: Okay, well, I can appreciate that.

Nehemiah: We’ve gone out for over a month at different times. We’ve followed the Grateful Dead circuit for many, many years. Not gone into the concerts, but we’ve got into the parking lots and administered free medical care, help people coming off acids, stitching them up, bruises and cuts.

Nehemia: Wow, that’s quite a ministry.

Nehemiah: It was a big sacrifice and it bore much fruit.

Nehemia: I’ve been to the parking lot of a Grateful Dead concert.

Nehemiah: It’s quite the scene.

Nehemia: It’s a sub-culture in itself.

Nehemiah: It is a sub-culture.

Nehemia: It’s something to see, as you said, independent from the concert.

Nehemiah: That’s correct.

Nehemia: Actually, I was a teenager when I did it and it was kind of scary, to be honest with you.

Nehemiah: Yeah. This is a 1955 Scenic Cruiser, and a 1949 Aerocoach put on top.

Nehemia: Put on top. That’s so cool. Are there codes that you have to fulfill to be allowed to do something like this?

Nehemiah: Severe common-sense codes, and we did have this DOT approved by different mechanics that would come…

Nehemia: DOT are the…

Nehemiah: The Department of Transportation.

Nehemia: You have the code of transportation…

Nehemiah: Yes, that’s right.

Nehemia: … to take this into different states. Are there rules that limit how you can do that? Or they don’t care about buses… I know trucks, like if you license in each state to drive a truck through…

Nehemiah: Well, it’s an RV, so that makes it…

Nehemia: An RV, okay.

Nehemiah: A Revolutionary Vehicle. Yeah, that’s correct.

Nehemia: Because it’s an RV, therefore it doesn’t have to be licensed by each state or whatever.

Nehemiah: No, it does not. We just have to make sure we had common sense in the fabrication and building that it would be safe for years to come. So, we actually brought it beyond what its original frame and chassis was and made it safer than when it was originally created, because we care about people.

Nehemia: And you actually did this. You can’t buy a bus like this.

Nehemiah: You cannot buy a bus like this.

Nehemia: Do you sell buses like this?

Nehemiah: We would never sell buses like this, no. Because first of all, no one would be able to afford them.

Nehemia: What would it cost if a bus like this were to be sold?

Nehemiah: We’ve been offered money for this bus, seriously.

Nehemia: How much?

Nehemiah: 3.5 million.

Nehemia: 3.5 million for this bus.

Nehemiah: Yeah. We said no.

Nehemia: Okay. So, you don’t leave this bus unattended in the parking lot. Or in the middle of nowhere.

Nehemiah: No, we have someone upon it.

Asuria: You can’t, because there’s always someone at the door. It has to be so they can see inside.

Nehemiah: This creates instant conversations.

Nehemia: Okay. And that’s kind of the idea.

Nehemiah: It’s a wonderful place of hospitality where we care for people.

Nehemia: So, people would come in.

Nehemiah: Oh, yes. We just came back from being on the Appalachian Trail for 10 days. We set up all the tents outside our bus and we just took care of people. We served like 70 gallons of soup and 40 gallons of tea. And we just helped people coming off the Trail and we had a place of refuge for them.

Nehemia: That’s very, very cool.

Nehemiah: Yeah, so we love doing things like that.

Nehemia: Wow, this is a pretty cool bus.

Nehemiah: Yeah, it took about two-and-a-half years to make.

Nehemia: This took two-and-a-half years to make?

Nehemiah: But we did other projects in the interim, so it would take less time…

Nehemia: So, it wasn’t two-and-a-half full-time years.

Nehemiah: Yeah.

Nehemia: It was over two-and-half years it’s done.

Nehemiah: Yeah, yeah. And it’s been on the road for 10 years since we built it.

Nehemia: Really? And how many buses do you have like this?

Nehemiah: There’s two that’s very similar to this. And then, right down the street we have a bus shop where we’re fabricating some other buses. Smaller, different sizes.

Nehemia: So, this bus belongs to the Pulaski…

Nehemiah: 12 tribes, LLC.

Nehemia: …community. This is back to me being a Jew and trying to figure out how the rules work, the legal situation. So, if somebody came from the Vermont community and said, “We want to use this bus…”

Nehemiah: We would just discuss in council about where the greatest need is, because we get that all the time.

Nehemia: Oh, you do?

Nehemiah: Yeah. We’ve sent it out to California for a couple months. Sometimes it’s over there for almost a year, and then we send it up to DC area for a few months.

Nehemia: What if you had a conflict where two communities come to you at the same time and say, “We both really need this bus.”

Nehemiah: We humble ourselves.

Nehemia: “And we’ve prayed about it, and we’ve both been led that we need this bus.” How would you make that decision? Or has that just never happened?

Asuria: We’d probably end up going to both events.

Nehemiah: One would have the bus, and one would not.

Asuria: We would change drivers and drive through the night. It’s happened many times.

Nehemia: It has happened…

Nehemiah: Oh, yeah.

Nehemia: …where they both needed the bus?

Nehemiah: Yeah, pony express style. I’ve driven to Arkansas and then up just about into Texas so they could take the bus out west. We’ve done that many times.

Nehemia: That’s actually come up.

Nehemiah: There are people in a parking lot, or it could be anywhere where there’s people that we need to have that divine appointment. And so, we see that’s very imperative.

Nehemia: Is that you guys singing that music?

Nehemiah: Yes, that was a music conference we had in North Carolina.

Nehemia: You produce your own music?

Nehemiah: Yes, and we have hundreds of songs that we’ve written.

Nehemia: That you’ve written, wow! Okay.

Nehemiah: And we have dances that go with the songs, which is really nice.

Nehemia: I saw a video on the internet of the Israeli folk dancing. I don’t know what you guys call that.

Nehemiah: Yeah, folk dancing. We call it that, yeah.

Nehemia: Israeli folk dancing.

Nehemiah: Yeah, we really love doing that. It’s very inclusive way. When we take the buses out, we like to take musicians out with the bus and have Israeli folk dancing, especially when we’re at different concerts, because it really draws the young people. And it’s a marvelous way to get to know people and have people come and enter in.

Nehemia: All right, well, thank you so much for taking the time and talking to me and showing me this stuff. I really appreciate it.

Nehemiah: You’re totally welcome.

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