Hebrew Voices #111 – Does John 6:4 Belong in the New Testament – PART 2 of 4

In this episode of Hebrew Voices, Does John 6:4 Belong in the New Testament - PART 2 of 4, we examine the controversy about the Gospel of John which has raged for nearly 2,000 years, as we continue our 4-part series to solve a textual conundrum using technology John could not have imagined and drawing on resources unavailable even a few years ago. Be sure to first watch Part 1!

I look forward to reading your comments!


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  • KT says:

    I am enjoying this series. Thank you!

    I became a bit discombobulated regarding the discussion of the counting of Passovers by Polycarp’s disciple [my lack of hearing made me uncertain if the name gives was that of Irenaeus or someone else]. Anyway, it “sounded” to me that the discussion leaned toward interpreting his ommission of John 6:4 to mean that verse didn’t exist in that disciples available versions.

    Elsewhere in the discussion I think I heard a reference to one text referencing Tabernacles or another Feast and that the reference to Passover might be a later modification.

    If that’s the case, wouldn’t it make sence for Polycarp’s disciple to not include John 6:4 if it did in fact exist in his versions — because his versions might have referenced Tabernacles. So, unless my bad ears derailed my understanding of the discussion completely, the chat about this fellow might not absolutely support the asdumption John 6:4 was completely missing in the ancient versions available to him.

    I have an additional humble suggestion, because I love how this group works into the details and textual history. It would be great if they discuss the unnamed Feast of John 5 in even greater detail. It sounded as though most scholars are all but certain it was Passover. What would be the impact of it being another feast, say First Fruits, Tabernacles, etc? If that’s a possibility, would that impact the 1-year versus >2-year or 3.5-year ministry of Jesus? If so, I think a future discussion of this in greater detail woud be a very informative.

  • KT says:

    Sorry … one other comment/question:

    Much of the discussion seems [to my busted ears] to interpret the writings of the John and the other Gospels ina chronological order.

    Granted, much of it certainly is, as we can read in the authors’ references within the texts themselves.

    But when it gets down to counting Passovers and the spacing and order in which they were written — does the overall text support this?

    Nehemiah would know about this far better and more accurately than I, but doesn’t even the Old Testement writing style jump around [chronologically] a bit? Even the story of creation and Adam snd Eve?

    I may likely be completely mistaken or erring in context. Does some of the ancient Hebrew writing style follow this kind of return to references divorced from chronological storytelling? Maybe not — I believe the ancient “church fathers” the discussion referenced assumed a complete chronological order, with no jumping-back in the narrative. But do we know the entries in question are chronological in context? If not, would that imoact the study of John 6:4, or the concern regarding “bunching” passovers too close together (which seems to rely on a steady chronology throughout each chapter of the Gospels).

    Also, just because only 2 or possibly 3 Pasdovers were written about, does that absolutely mean there couldn’t have been some John and the others didn’t include? Just because something wasn’t written about doesn’t unnecessarily prove it didn’t happen — unless of course the context of everything else makes it impossible to allow for such.

    Thank you for tollerating these long-winded comments. I won’t make a habit of it; it’s just been excellent and thought-provoking series.

  • Nunya Biz says:

    Soooooo close, can’t u taste it? If y’all cud just see the last supper was the night of the 10th, beginning of 11th The Aviv, from the “simple reading of the text”. (Bibliography: Matt.26:2,17,20, Mark14:1, 12, 17, Luke22:1, 7, 14, John 12:1,12, n John13:1,2)